can i use brake clean on my starter motor

Why do people spray brake clean into intake manifold to help start a diesel? I have an older vw diesel and it didnt want to start today untill i sprayed brake clean in the intake. What is happening there?

That is what I am trying to do. If I can find out why it starts when I do that it will help me narrow down why it is not starting.

It does that because the engine is igniting it. :rolleyes:

Sounds like the engine is not getting fuel or not getting it at the right time. What engine is it? What is the problem? What work has been done to the car recently?

Never a good idea to spray anything into the intake of a TDI. If you do too much or the glow plug lights it off, you can bend rods, crack pistons or cause other severe engine damage. Think about it, if the piston is coming up and it lights off early, the combustion is trying to force the piston back down when it still has to come up.

If everything else is as it should be, the engine will start without issue.

Last edited: Sep 18, 2010

Well this was more a general diesel question. Today was the first cold day of the year and my van vw t4 2.4L didnt want to start. First winter I have it. I know my cam belt needs changing for sure so that would make sense. It has a lever that you pull and it advances the timing and it runs really well like that. I just remember when I worked at ford some of the guys would shoot that in the intake to get them going. I thought someone here might shed some light on what it does, and you guys did, excellent. Timing is what it must be.

Last edited: Sep 18, 2010

jasonTDI

TDI GURU Vendor , w/Business number

We already stated what it does. It preignights and damages the rings and pistons. Stop doing it. Period. You have a fuel or timing issue. Fix that first.

Unless you want a new set of rings....or rods.

bhtooefr

TDIClub Enthusiast, ToofTek Inventor

Ether is an addictive drug for a diesel. Use it, and then it breaks the rings, and then you have crap compression and need it every time, and then it bends the rods from being used too much, and the engine barely starts even with it.

Never use it on a diesel, unless the manufacturer of the engine specifically recommends otherwise (IIRC, some Detroit Diesel 2-strokes were designed to use ether to start with.)

Timing is what it must be.

Unfortunately you haven't really isolated the issue much by spraying a very volatile fluid down the intake... you've simply given it a fuel that it can pretty much burn no matter what condition the engine is in.

If the engine has been starting reasonably well until it started to get cold I'd suspect the glow plugs first. Your IDI engine will need at least 3 of the 5 of them working properly once fall arrives. On your T4 there's a glow plug harness you can pull and then check each plug for continuity to ground... if any of them are burned out I'd recommend replacing all 5. You should also check that power is being delivered to the harness properly.

Next possibility... timing, as has been suggested already.

Third possibility.. poor compression, making cold weather starts difficult.

A starting fluid like ether or brake cleaner will help start an engine with any one of the above issues... until the rings break etc.. ;-)

Last edited: Sep 18, 2010

Unfortunately you haven't really isolated the issue much by spraying a very volatile fluid down the intake... you've simply given it a fuel that it can pretty much burn no matter what condition the engine is in.

If the engine has been starting reasonably well until it started to get cold I'd suspect the glow plugs first. Your IDI engine will need at least 3 of the 5 of them working properly once fall arrives. On your T4 there's a glow plug harness you can pull and then check each plug for continuity to ground... if any of them are burned out I'd recommend replacing all 5. You should also check that power is being delivered to the harness properly.

Next possibility... timing, as has been suggested already.

Third possibility.. poor compression, making cold weather starts difficult.

A starting fluid like ether or brake cleaner will help start an engine with any one of the above issues... until the rings break etc.. ;-)

Thanks for that info. I notice a few guys have said plugs and compression, will check out. Very interesting stuff. I will check these things out for sure, and no more spraying the intake. I only did it once this morning when I was testing stuff out. I was ripping around today and it ran good so hopefully no damage was done. I was really worried this morning. I thought the time had come to rip out the BEW from the jetta and slap it in the T4.

Last edited: Sep 18, 2010

Yeah, a shot or two is not going to cause any lasting damage most likely.

My bro has a 2.4l T4... he loves it but it is slow slow slow... a BEW transplant is a great idea.

Oh yes, I know what you mean. I love my T4 to pieces but as you say, slow as molasses. If the T4 ran like the Jetta I would be in heaven. The day I find an engine for the Jetta (2.5L PD) the transformation shall begin. Its a bit rusty but I will fix all that. It will be new again this winter. I have 5 dogs so its perfect for me.

Last edited: Sep 18, 2010

I would check glowplugs first.
When a engine runs fine, you stop,tries to start it the next cold day and it won't start it usually is glowplugs.
Why would timing change during overnight?
Unless broken belt, clogged fuel filter or "frozen" diesel in extreme cold weather occurs, it is usually glowplugs.
Check the easiest things first and then move on to the next step.
My brother had a 1994 t4 diesel (without turbo).When it didn't start one day, he checked the glowplugs and they were history.
He replaced 4 out of 5, since the last one was PIA to get to.
Ran fine after that and had never starting problems again.

"...when used in moderation..."

The big problem is that the line between "moderation" and instantaneous major engine damage when spraying ether or other combustibles into the intake is very thin, impossible to judge from the outside, and has been crossed many times by people trying to start a Diesel which has other problems that should have been fixed to make it start properly.

To the list of major damage already compiled in this thread, I'd add blown head gaskets and cracked blocks and bent cranks, just to round out the picture [g].

-dan

Last edited: Sep 19, 2010

Most aerosols now use propane as an accelerant instead of CFCs, thats why people use them as quick starters. I have to use a "starting aid" on my chevette to get it going, but I also know all the dangers associated with it. All it usually needs is one super quick puff in the vicinity of the intake to kick it over a little bit faster and then it will light the diesel right up. Between the pump being gummed up, and my fuel bleed back issues with it, I guarantee that none of you will get it to start without

More than likely that Cat engine was on it's way out to begin with.

Trust me, ether, used in moderation, ruining an engine is 100% an old wifes tale.

Yes of course if you spray 1/2 a can down the intake it will break parts.

Had a CAT V12, (might have been a D398, was in a large mid 80s front end loader) that happened to. Had factory installed ether cold start and the button was sticky. It was a momentary push button and you just pushed for 2-3 secs and that's it. Well the operator didn't realize botton was stuck and it emptied out the whole can (size of those blue propane torch tanks).

My uncle has an Oliver 1855 tractor with a Waukesha 6 cylinder diesel. My grandfather bought it in the late 70s. For whatever reason the glow plugs never worked right and my grandfather isn't a mechanic, so just resorted to using a shot of ether. This was his main tractor, so used day in a day out until 1994 when he retired, then it was just used for chores and snow removal.

Well my uncle got the tractor in 2007, fixed the glowplugs, works just fine. So... 30 years of ether use...

Back in teh day WD40 would work well. The propellant was propane I think and the oil helped to lube the top end (better than very dry ether). Plus most anyone has a random can or two of WD40 rolling under the floor in the service truck. I tried it not that long ago and it wouldn't work, so I guess the propellant has changed.

Last edited: Sep 19, 2010